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How would you order each TF cartoon/movie/OVA you've seen...

TF:Prime, Animated, Beast Wars, G1, you name it!

Re: How would you order each TF cartoon/movie/OVA you've see

Postby Byrerprime » Tue Jan 11, 2011 6:56 pm

Cartoons:

Beast Wars
Prime (so far)
Animated
Cybertron
Beast Machines
Armada
G1
Energon

Movies:

2007
1986
ROTF

I've only seen the "Theft of the Golden Disk", so cannot compare it to others.
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Re: How would you order each TF cartoon/movie/OVA you've see

Postby ironrod prime » Wed Jan 12, 2011 8:47 pm

tv shows

beast wars
beast machines
prime
animated
g1
cybertron
energon
armada
rid

movies
g1
rotf
07
Image
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Re: How would you order each TF cartoon/movie/OVA you've see

Postby Wing Saber » Wed Jan 12, 2011 9:08 pm

ironrod prime wrote:tv shows

beast wars
beast machines
prime
animated
g1
cybertron
energon
armada
rid

Byrerprime wrote:Cartoons:

Beast Wars
Prime (so far)
Animated
Cybertron
Beast Machines
Armada
G1
Energon

Why am I the only one who doesn't put the Unicron Trilogy in or near last?
I admit, Energon was pretty crappy, but they did have alot of good ideas, even if most of them were screwed up or portrayed horribly.
Armada may have had bad animation, but it was still a good show!
and Cybertron was pretty beastly!
plus, alot of people trash it for having so many continuity errors, and if you're one of those people, I suggest you rewatch G1! you will find quite a few continuity errors! example, Devastator's origins. In the episode 'Heavy Metal War' Starscream says that he and megatron built them in 'those caves', yet in the episode 'The Secret of Omega Supreme', Omega claims to have worked with them on Cybertron, and megatron used his machine to rewire them, turning them evil.
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Re: How would you order each TF cartoon/movie/OVA you've see

Postby Sabrblade » Thu Jan 13, 2011 12:03 am

Wing Saber wrote:Why am I the only one who doesn't put the Unicron Trilogy in or near last?
Didn't you once say that the Unicron Trilogy is what introduced you to the Transformers? If that's the case, then it's because you may find it to be nostalgic. Nostalgia tends to affect one's opinion over critical thinking in some ways. This is one of the main reasons why so many put G1 over such competent series as Beast Wars, Beast Machines*, and Animated.

* - it may have been iffy with other series, but it was solidly crafted together on its own

Wing Saber wrote:I admit, Energon was pretty crappy, but they did have alot of good ideas, even if most of them were screwed up or portrayed horribly.
Yes, but the bad still outweighs the good. The interesting ideas lose their merit when they become moot.

Wing Saber wrote:Armada may have had bad animation, but it was still a good show!
It wasn't just the animation (which at times did get pretty good, especially in the Japanese version*), it was the rushed dialogue, the erroneous and poor quality scripting, and its repetitive first half. The Unicron Battles were good, though.

* - Check out these images comparing the Japanese and English version of the episode "Linkup". Certain scenes were redrawn to improve the episode quality. Japanese on the left, English on the right.

Wing Saber wrote:and Cybertron was pretty beastly!
I ranked it kinda high up.

Not to mention that I said that my ratings of the Unicron Trilogy (and RiD) may be subject to change once I see more of the Japanese versions (which are usually higher in overall quality).

Wing Saber wrote:plus, alot of people trash it for having so many continuity errors, and if you're one of those people, I suggest you rewatch G1! you will find quite a few continuity errors! example, Devastator's origins. In the episode 'Heavy Metal War' Starscream says that he and megatron built them in 'those caves', yet in the episode 'The Secret of Omega Supreme', Omega claims to have worked with them on Cybertron, and megatron used his machine to rewire them, turning them evil.
Most people cut some slack because how G1 was both the first go at a TF series, and from a time when quality wasn't heavily emphasized as it is today.

Cybertron, however has little-to-no excuse for its errors, as it's more recent and has had numerous series to base itself off of without messing up with the continuity errors that it had.

But, it's not like there haven't been attempts to mend its mistakes. The Cybertron comics by Fun Publications have gone to explain how everyone's suffering from memory problems due to the black hole warping reality (despite how lame and cliche that may sound).
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Re: How would you order each TF cartoon/movie/OVA you've see

Postby Sabrblade » Sun Jan 23, 2011 9:42 pm

I just recently got through watching an old 1980s cartoon called Robotix, which was retconned by the AllSpark Almanac II book into being a Transformers series. But since it wasn't originally conceived as such, I'll leave it off my list of cartoons.

Then again, since I went through and watched it all and don't want to neglect it, if I were to include it (hypothetically), I'd put at number 7.5, below the three-way of G1, Armada and Victory, but above the Playskool Go-Bots cartoon.

Now if only I could watch the Tonka Challenge of the GoBots cartoon to give it a fair judgement.
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“Critics who treat 'adult' as a term of approval, instead of as a merely descriptive term, cannot be adult themselves. To be concerned about being grown up, to admire the grown up because it is grown up, to blush at the suspicion of being childish; these things are the marks of childhood and adolescence. And in childhood and adolescence they are, in moderation, healthy symptoms. Young things ought to want to grow. But to carry on into middle life or even into early manhood this concern about being adult is a mark of really arrested development. When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty I read them openly. When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.” -- C.S. Lewis
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Re: How would you order each TF cartoon/movie/OVA you've see

Postby TriPredRavage » Wed Feb 23, 2011 8:54 pm

Okay, only listing that which I have seen enough of to count...

Cartoons
Beast Wars - Revolutionary visuals with the best writing, characters, and acting. Plus, only series to win an Emmy

Animated - Unique art style, excellent writing, characters, and acting. However, season 3 began by making everything that happened at the end of season 2 inconsequential and left too many plot threads untied at the end of the series.

Masterforce/Victory - tie - likeable characters with anime style action while keeping to the G1 feel.

Beast Machines - Actually the best graphics of all shows with Matrix style editing and camera work. Loses points for writing not being true to the characters that had been established, but tells the darkest story in Transformers history to date (key phrase: "to date. This very well could, and probably will change).

Beast Wars II - Brought toy characters I always wanted to see alive. A decent plot considering that the entire series was made to keep interest in the Beast Wars franchise while Seasons 2 & 3 were being made, until they were translated to Japanese as Metals.

Cybertron - Despite odd choices in the dubbing process, such as voice changes, randomly developed accents, and trying to tie it to two shows it had nothing to do with, while actually doing very little to make it in continuity, I liked the multiple worlds aspect of this series and really enjoyed the characters. It also gets points for making homages to G1 and the Beast Era, rather than just G1, as most other series did.

Beast Wars Neo - By far the weakest in the Beast Era series (unless you count RiD, which I do on some days, and don't on others). Introduced some really great characters, actually, but the show doesn't pick up until the final third of the series, and then ends the whole series with a clip show. Also, it has probably my least favorite theme song in TF history, lol.

Energon - It's hard to say what I like about Energon, because there is so much going against it. A lot was lost in the translation (literally), but over all I think the plot of the series was good, even if the implimentation was poor. I put it over Armada if for no other reason than that Unicron actually played a part in it, unlike where in Armada, he simply died just because Megatron/Galvatron died.

Armada - Armada had some of the weakest art in all of TF series, if not the weakest of all. It's wildly inconsistent from one frame to the next and looks downright awful at times. When the plot is finally revealed to be all about Unicron, nothing happens. Unicron is played out to be the big evil of the whole series, only to do nothing and disappear in the end. Kudos for the Transmetal Rhinox cameo, though!

Generation One/Prime/Robots in Disguise - threeway tie - The only reason that these three are so low is because I found them to be the most boring of the series. G1 is hard to hold that against it because that's just its age showing, but it is pretty dull in a majority of episodes, and I say that with love. Prime I just don't find interesting. It hasn't done anything original as far as I have seen yet. Despite having an excellent voice cast, it's just not up to par story-telling-wise, and its CGI is actually really poor (15 years after Beast Wars, and it's not as good? C'mon!). RiD suffers for a lot of reasons. For one, it was a filler series. Two, the dub was happening right as 9/11 took place and it became the victim of mass censoring. I liked the Beasts being in the show, as I was on such a high from Beast Wars still after those two years of Beast Machines, but the whole plot was lost in the dub.

Theatrical Movies
Transformers - I have nothing bad to say about this movie. It was fun, it was flashy, it played good homages, and the visuals were amazing. I thought the acting was actually very strong in this movie, and it was well made.

Beast Wars II: Lio Convoy in Imminent Danger - Typical anime movie having no weight on the plot of the series and questionable continuity around, but it was still good. Optimus Primal's appearance makes for all sorts of continuity issues (like him having a Matrix of his own), but that stems from the Japanese translation of the original Beast Wars. Nonetheless, it was cool to See Optimus and Leo fighting the good fight together.

The Transformers: The Movie - Fun, but very 80's, lol. The movie loses points for it later being undone in the series by having Optimus revive, so making the fans put up with Rodimus for so long was almost cruel, lol. I'd almost tie it with the BWII movie... but I really just don't care for Rodimus...

Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen - it's no surprise that this film is last. It's almost a joke (and I actually enjoy this film, mind you). The plot makes no sense (the 'cons need energon to make their clone army! ...but then later... they have a clone army anyway!) Optimus dies, and rather than revive him with the Allspark shard... they have to go on a wild goose chase for the Matrix... There are just so many plot holes, that the film is easily the worst movie in the entire franchise.

OVAs
Transformers: RobotMasters - Fight! The Group of the Strongest Commanders! - All in all, a fun little story. Crazy continuity issues, but still a lot of fun to see Optimus Prime fighting along side Optimus Primal. I would really love to see the Robot Masters OVAs get official dubs and see the characters be named in English by their closest counterparts (such as Gigant Bomb and Smokesniper maybe being G2 Somescreen and Dreadwind, and Wing Stun being Machine Wars Thundercracker), but I don't foresee that ever happening (not meant to imply that they are in fact those characters, but I think it'd be a good way to homage the past TF Universes that never really had exposure).

Transformers: RobotMasters - The Lio Convoy Typhoon Enters - I'd almost put this one above the first one because it's a little more exciting, but it's so dependant on the first one, I really can't. This time around, it was awesome to see Prime, Primal, and Leo stand off against both Megatrons, but the battle is kind of anticlimactic for how awesome the OVA starts off.

Scramble City: Mobilization - I don't really have anything to say about Scramble City. I know why it was made, but I never thought it was necessary. New TFs showed up all the time; why they needed an explanation as to why Metroplex came to be never really made sense to me.

Zone - Enter the New Supreme Commander, Dai Atlas! There's a reason why this never took off as a series or anything more than this OVA and manga - it's just pretty bad. It introduces all of these new characters who are so amazing, while throwing together the greatest 'Cons of G1 lore and just... didn't really do anything. It's not even really entertaining to watch. And the human/alien kid and his pet thing were just weird.

Theft of the Golden Disk - Despite that it got David Kaye back to voice his iconic character, I really hate TotGD. It's supposed to lead up to DofP, but it didn't stay true to the character designs in that comic, and some of the characterizations were just completely off (like Scorponok). It was cool to see Cryotek, but he wasn't particularly acted out well, and the writing was pretty poor all around. The entire project is just very fannish. Meaning, it was very clearly not professional, and it showed. It could have been great, but it really just wasn't that good at all.

Scramble City (stop-motion toys version) - As unnecessary as I thought Scramble City was... this was all that and a bag of chips. There's really not much to say about it other than that. It's last on the list because it's the most unnecessary of them all.
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Re: How would you order each TF cartoon/movie/OVA you've see

Postby Sabrblade » Wed Feb 23, 2011 11:07 pm

Awesome comments, TPR!

A few words, though.

TriPredRavage wrote:Animated - Unique art style, excellent writing, characters, and acting. However, season 3 began by making everything that happened at the end of season 2 inconsequential and left too many plot threads untied at the end of the series.
Many/most of these were cleared up in the AllSpark Almanac II. They likely would have been explained in the apocryphal fourth season, had the show not been cancelled after its third season. Animated was very underrated overall.

TriPredRavage wrote:Energon - It's hard to say what I like about Energon, because there is so much going against it. A lot was lost in the translation (literally), but over all I think the plot of the series was good, even if the implimentation was poor. I put it over Armada if for no other reason than that Unicron actually played a part in it, unlike where in Armada, he simply died just because Megatron/Galvatron died.
Even then, he didn't die. He still proceeded to eat worlds for the next ten years, only going offline once he was knocked out by the Planet Q's core exploding in his face.

TriPredRavage wrote:Armada - Armada had some of the weakest art in all of TF series, if not the weakest of all. It's wildly inconsistent from one frame to the next and looks downright awful at times. When the plot is finally revealed to be all about Unicron, nothing happens. Unicron is played out to be the big evil of the whole series, only to do nothing and disappear in the end. Kudos for the Transmetal Rhinox cameo, though!
A TON of the artwork was improved when Japan got it as Micron Densetsu. For example, look at this episode compariosn between the two versions of "Linkup".

TriPredRavage wrote:Generation One/Prime/Robots in Disguise - threeway tie -
I don't think it's fair to include Prime on this list since only 8 episodes have aired and there are 52+ episodes planned for this series (at least 26 are already done).

TriPredRavage wrote:Prime I just don't find interesting. It hasn't done anything original as far as I have seen yet. Despite having an excellent voice cast, it's just not up to par story-telling-wise, and its CGI is actually really poor (15 years after Beast Wars, and it's not as good? C'mon!).
Now, that last statement cannot be true, since the staff has confirmed that Prime uses the most advanced, most "cutting edge", and most up-to-date CGI for television of any TV show (TF or otherwise) ever produced.

TriPredRavage wrote:RiD suffers for a lot of reasons. For one, it was a filler series.
So were BWII and Neo.

TriPredRavage wrote:Transformers Universe - I can actually just barely remember this. It was cool to see what happened next after Beast Machines, but it never really fleshed out, so I can't put it anywhere but last.
I think you're a little confused. There was no post-Beast Machines Universe cartoon. Only comics.

TriPredRavage wrote:Scramble City: Mobilization - I don't really have anything to say about Scramble City. I know why it was made, but I never thought it was necessary. New TFs showed up all the time; why they needed an explanation as to why Metroplex came to be never really made sense to me.
Technically, the FSRLTF manga built up this by alluding to Metroplex's creation ahead of time while he was being constructed. Trypticon even showed up there while Metroplex was still being built, so he was built even sooner.

TriPredRavage wrote:Zone - Enter the New Supreme Commander, Dai Atlas! There's a reason why this never took off as a series or anything more than this OVA and manga - it's just pretty bad. It introduces all of these new characters who are so amazing, while throwing together the greatest 'Cons of G1 lore and just... didn't really do anything. It's not even really entertaining to watch. And the human/alien kid and his pet thing were just weird.
It did take off in the form of story pages, though. Some even took place before this episode (and its manga chapter counterpart), meaning that this wasn't the beginning proper of the story. Its later stories (however brief they were covered) were kinda epic.

TriPredRavage wrote:Theft of the Golden Disk - Despite that it got David Kaye back to voice his iconic character, I really hate TotGD. It's supposed to lead up to DofP, but it didn't stay true to the character designs in that comic, and some of the characterizations were just completely off (like Scorponok). It was cool to see Cryotek, but he wasn't particularly acted out well, and the writing was pretty poor all around. The entire project is just very fannish. Meaning, it was very clearly not professional, and it showed. It could have been great, but it really just wasn't that good at all.
Meh, to each his own, I guess. I really liked it.

TriPredRavage wrote:Scramble City (stop-motion toys version) - As unnecessary as I thought Scramble City was... this was all that and a bag of chips. There's really not much to say about it other than that. It's last on the list because it's the most unnecessary of them all.
At first I thought this was gonna be ridiculously stupid. But as it played on, I found it to be ridiculously hilarious. One of those "so bad it's good" deals. I liked it for lulz and it was just plain laughable wackiness. :lol:
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Re: How would you order each TF cartoon/movie/OVA you've see

Postby Agent X » Thu Feb 24, 2011 12:11 am

pesonally i was going to wait to do this because of the possibility of getting the Takara series but hell ill do it now

Movies
Transformers the Movie: it was my inroduction to the francise
2007
Beast Wars
RoTF: by primus it would be higher (if there was more movies) if it wasn't for leo spitz and making me say Wheelie was better

TV
Armada
Beast Macheins: just a few years ago this would have been at eh bottom of my list
G1
Beast Wars
Animated
RiD
Prime
Cybertron
Energon: overall not bad until the midpoint but the animation for the Cybertronians is just bad

OVA
Theft of the Golden Disk
Scramble City (stop motion)
Robot Masters
Scramble City (animation)
Zone
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Re: How would you order each TF cartoon/movie/OVA you've see

Postby Sabrblade » Thu Feb 24, 2011 12:16 am

Agent X wrote:Movies
Transformers the Movie
2007
Beast Wars
RoTF
Cool. Not many have seen the Beast Wars II movie, as it was never released in English.

Agent X wrote:Prime
I wouldn't call it fair to include Prime just ye, as only 8/52+ episodes have aired.

Agent X wrote:Robot Masters
Which one? Or, is it a tie between both?
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“Critics who treat 'adult' as a term of approval, instead of as a merely descriptive term, cannot be adult themselves. To be concerned about being grown up, to admire the grown up because it is grown up, to blush at the suspicion of being childish; these things are the marks of childhood and adolescence. And in childhood and adolescence they are, in moderation, healthy symptoms. Young things ought to want to grow. But to carry on into middle life or even into early manhood this concern about being adult is a mark of really arrested development. When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty I read them openly. When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.” -- C.S. Lewis
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Re: How would you order each TF cartoon/movie/OVA you've see

Postby TriPredRavage » Thu Feb 24, 2011 12:21 am

Sabrblade wrote:Many/most of these were cleared up in the AllSpark Almanac II. They likely would have been explained in the apocryphal fourth season, had the show not been cancelled after its third season. Animated was very underrated overall.

The problem with that (and subsequentially what I'm going to pick at most of what you said in response to me) is that the AllSpark Almanac is outside of the animated series. While it may clear up those things, it doesn't solve those problems that exist within the series. So, while it's nice that the AA can give us some insight to why those short comings came to be or how they would have resolved, it doesn't actually resolve them, so those issues still exist and stand against the series. But I do agree; Animated was underrated. Despite the third season's shortcomings, it still had some fantastic moments, but it was without a doubt in my mind the weakest of the three seasons. But, the series was still strong enough to make my number 2!

Sabrblade wrote:Even then, he didn't die. He still proceeded to eat worlds for the next ten years, only going offline once he was knocked out by the Planet Q's core exploding in his face.

Meh, it was still an anticlimactic end to Armada.

Sabrblade wrote:A TON of the artwork was improved when Japan got it as Micron Densetsu. For example, look at this episode compariosn between the two versions of "Linkup".

I always think it's funny how well you and I know the TF lore. Sometimes I feel like we're telling each other things we already know, lol. I did know about the improved art in Micron Legend, but I had never actually seen it. That's ridiculous, and makes me kinda upset. :/

Sabrblade wrote:I don't think it's fair to include Prime on this list since only 8 episodes have aired and there are 52+ episodes planned for this series (at least 26 are already done).
Sabrblade wrote:I wouldn't call it fair to include Prime just ye, as only 8/52+ episodes have aired.

Have 8 episodes aired? I thought only 7 had. Either way, if you were going to be finicky about people's ratings of Prime and their reasons why, then you shouldn't have included it. ;) Also, don't forget there was a planned 4th season for Animated as well, so don't let the planned 52+ episodes weigh heavily on you. You'd be better to only consider what will be, rather than what might. ...Like Dinobot with the Golden Discs! :lol:

Sabrblade wrote:Now, that last statement cannot be true, since the staff has confirmed that Prime uses the most advanced, most "cutting edge", and most up-to-date CGI for television of any TV show (TF or otherwise) ever produced.

That statment is absolutely true. Up-to-date or not, it looks bad. The textures are very limited, the backgrounds are bland, the artstyle is awkward; it just looks bad. Even season 1 of Beast Wars had more textures than that. Sure, Cheetor could have used some better fur texture, and they all could have had shadows, but still. That was 15 years ago. Have you seen (Beast) Megatron's scales?! Texture!

Sabrblade wrote:So were BWII and Neo.
TriPredRavage wrote:A decent plot considering that the entire series was made to keep interest in the Beast Wars franchise while Seasons 2 & 3 were being made, until they were translated to Japanese as Metals.

I know, I said that. Not those exact words, but I definitely acknowledged that.

Sabrblade wrote:I think you're a little confused. There was no post-Beast Machines Universe cartoon. Only comics.

Then help me clear this up. I remember there was a DVD/CD that came with the Universe figures that had an Armada episode on it and a sort of flash video of Universe stuff on it. If I could find my disc, I would watch it, but god only knows where it is today.

Sabrblade wrote:Technically, the FSRLTF manga built up this by alluding to Metroplex's creation ahead of time while he was being constructed. Trypticon even showed up there while Metroplex was still being built, so he was built even sooner.

Again, that's from the Manga, not the actual OVA. So, like with the AllSpark Almanac and Animated, it doesn't really have any weight on the discussion at hand, because if it was, it would have to be something you'd need to know going into the OVA, but it's not. But, dude, I wish that IDW or somebody would get on translating the Mangas. I'd love to see FSRLTF, BWMetals, BWII, BWNeo (and its weird animals becoming Transformers... thing...), and all the others get to the states sometime.

Sabrblade wrote:It did take off in the form of story pages, though. Some even took place before this episode (and its manga chapter counterpart), meaning that this wasn't the beginning proper of the story. Its later stories (however brief they were covered) were kinda epic.

Again, that's story pages and not the OVA itself. I'm glad to hear, though, that they were good. I personally have no affection for Dai Atlas or Sonic Bomber at all. I just didn't like how they were these huge big shots that were clearly the best of the best EVER. It's like... nobody wants to watch a show where the good guy is going to win no sweat, y'know?

Sabrblade wrote:At first I thought this was gonna be ridiculously stupid. But as it played on, I found it to be ridiculously hilarious. One of those "so bad it's good" deals. I liked it for lulz and it was just plain laughable wackiness. :lol:

I will admit, I'm always impressed by Japan's ability to make impressive stop-motion videos with Transformers. Even their old toy commercials for BWII figures were insane! :shock:
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